1st Bn The Winnipeg Grenadiers
General Information | ||
| Rank: | First Name: | Second Name: |
|---|---|---|
| Sergeant | John | Oliver |
| From: | Enlistment Region: | Date of Birth (y-m-d): |
| St. Vital MB | Manitoba | 1918-11-22 |
| Appointment: | Company: | Platoon: |
| Intelligence staff | Bn HQ | Intelligence |
Transportation - Home Base to Hong Kong
Members of 'C' Force from the East travelled across Canada by CNR troop train, picking up reinforcements enroute. Stops included Valcartier, Montreal, Ottawa, Armstrong ON, Capreol ON, Winnipeg, Melville SK, Saskatoon, Edmonton, Jasper, and Vancouver, arriving in Vancouver on Oct 27 at 0800 hrs.
The Winnipeg Grenadiers and the local soldiers that were with Brigade Headquarters from Winnipeg to BC travelled on a CPR train to Vancouver.
All members embarked from Vancouver on the ships AWATEA and PRINCE ROBERT. AWATEA was a New Zealand Liner and the PRINCE ROBERT was a converted cruiser. "C" Company of the Rifles was assigned to the PRINCE ROBERT, everyone else boarded the AWATEA. The ships sailed from Vancouver on Oct 27th and arrived in Hong Kong on November 16th, having made brief stops enroute at Honolulu and Manila.
Equipment earmarked for 'C' Force use was loaded on the ship DON JOSE, but would never reach Hong Kong as it was rerouted to Manila when hostilities commenced.
On arrival, all troops were quartered at Nanking Barracks, Sham Shui Po Camp, in Kowloon.
Battle Information
We do not have specific battle information for this soldier in our online database. For a detailed description of the battle from a Canadian perspective, visit Canadian Participation in the Defense of Hong Kong (published by the Historical Section, Canadian Military Headquarters).
Wounded Information
| Date Wounded | Wound Description | References |
|---|---|---|
| 41/12/24 | N/A |
Hospital Information
| Name of hospital | Date of admission | Date of discharge | Comments | Reference |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| HK-BMH | 12/24/1941 | N/A | 118(42 Sep 21) |
POW Camps
| Camp ID | Camp Name | Location | Company | Type of Work | Arrival Date | Departure Date |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| HK-SA-01 | Shamshuipo | Kowloon, Hong Kong | Capture | 42 Jan 22 | ||
| HK-NP-02 | North Point | North Point, Hong Kong Island | 42 Jan 22 | 42 Aug 20 |
Decorations Received
| Image | Name of Award | Abbreviation | References | Precedence | Comments |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
 | Mentioned-in-Despatches | MiD | 43 | 13 | Citation not found |
Commemorative Feature
A map detailing the location of this feature can be found in this soldier's vault. (See Vault explanation below in the Links and Other Resources block) .
| Site Description | Location | Province | Map Reference | Lat/Long | Date |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Payne Lake | north of Cockeram Lake, Manitoba | Manitoba | 64 C/15 | 56 55' 44"; 100 55' 27" | 1979 |
Other Military Service
No related information found. Please submit documents to us using the contact link at the top of this page.
Death and Cemetery Information
| Date of Death (y-m-d) | Cause of Death | Death Class | |
|---|---|---|---|
| 1942-08-20 | Executed by the Japanese | Died while POW | |
| Cemetery Location | Cemetery | Grave Number | Gravestone Marker |
| Cape Collinson Road Chai Wan Hong Kong China | Sai Wan War Cemetery | IX. D. 6. | NA |
Gravestone Image
H6016 John Payne- a drawing he made while in prison camp. See this talent noted in Kelvin High School article below
Obituary / Life Story
H6016 John PAYNE - born in Shewsbury, United Kingdom. Arrived in Canada 1923. He attended Earl Gray and Kelvin High schools. Enlistment: September 4, 1939 Winnipeg, Manitoba. Son of Benjamin Oliver and Margaret Corbet Payne (nee Weaver), of Fort Rouge, Manitoba
19-8-42 North Point Camp, China
Dear Mater:
I have decided, either fortunately or unfortunately as the case may be, to take a chance on getting through to Chungking. I've investigated as much as possible and feel sure we stand a jolly good chance of getting there. There are numerous reasons for this step, the chief being that the cholera season and fly season is starting. Dysentry and beriberi are high in camp, and anyway I'm already sick of Japanese hospitality.
You share, I know, my own views of fatalism, so for that reason I know you won't condemn my judgment. So just in case I shouldn't make it you must remember that according to our beliefs I have departed for a much nicer place I hope although it will grieve me to change the guitar for a harp even though there is a higher percentage of gold in the latter. But that's enough of this drivel, I'll be able to destroy this note to myself I'm sure, so bye bye for now. Best regards to Di and Yvonne. Tell Ben to join the airforce next war. Your devoted son, John
Links and Other Resources
There may be more information on this individual available elsewhere on our web sites - please use the search tool found in the upper right corner of this page to view sources.
Facebook has proven to be a valuable resource in the documentation of 'C' Force members. The following link will take you to any available search results for this soldier based on his regimental number. Note: results may be contained within another related record. Facebook Search Results
→ Related documentation for information published in this report, such as birth information, discharge papers, press clippings and census documents may be available via shared resources in our HKVCA Vault. It is organized with folders named using regimental numbers. Use the first letter of the individual's service number to choose the correct folder, then scroll to the specific sub-folder displaying the service number of your interest.
General Comments
Sergeant John O. Payne - With the Winnipeg Grenadiers on the non-permanent force, Sergeant John Payne went on active service when the regiment was mobilized, and served at Jamaica and Hong Kong. He was employed at Bulman Bro. Ltd., before the war and attended Earl Grey and Kelvin High Schools.
Picture & caption from Face Book Page- Operation Picture Me- Hong Kong [scanning from Winnipeg Tribune] by David Archer, 2016
The following taken from Kelvin History Spotlight JOHN PAYNE by Emma White [Kelvin High School Winnipeg, MB 2015]
Before joining the army, John had cultivated a proficiency in the arts. He was involved with painting the set of the school play, The Bells of Beaujolais. He also carved from Birchwood an intricate 32 piece chess set. He later became a commercial photographer, with intentions to enter art school.
John enlisted with the Winnipeg Grenadiers on September 4th, 1939. He was first sent to Jamaica on garrison duty. In 1941, the Grenadiers left for Hong Kong. On arrival, John wrote to his mother to inform her that the soldiers had had a perfect trip, very calm and very quiet. He also stated his intention to settle down after this wars over. However, the Japanese soon attacked the Hong Kong garrison where he was stationed, and by Christmas of 1941 had overwhelmingly defeated the underequipped and undermanned commonwealth forces. Though he was not killed, John was taken to North Point prison.
Inside the war camp John carved wooden objects, which he then sold to other inmates. He also created pen and ink drawings of life inside of the camp, such as eating utensils, the sleeping quarters of the prisoners, or footwear around the camp (one of his drawings is featured on the next page). As soon as he had entered the camp, John had been creating plans to escape.
On August 19th, 1942, his preparations were complete. He wrote to his mother, informing her that he felt he had to attempt an escape Chungking. He gave this letter to Sgt. Robert Manchester, requesting that he "Get that letter to [his] mother". "Inside the war camp John carved wooden objects, which he then sold to other inmates. He also created pen and ink drawings of life inside of the camp, such as eating utensils, the sleeping quarters of the prisoners, or footwear around the camp."
John and three other soldiers from Manitoba escaped the next morning, bringing enough food for ten days with them. They were aided by a powerful typhoon which reduced the prison guards' visibility. They intended to cross four miles of water by boat and, when on the mainland, traverse another thousand miles to reach Chungking. But the boat was swamped by the typhoon, and the Japanese soldiers caught up to the four men, immediately beating them, bayonetting them and hacking them with swords. They were then shot. John died at age twenty three.
John's mother was notified of his death in March 1945. However, she refused to believe that her son had died. Sgt. Manchester delivered John's letter to her in October 1945. John is buried in the Sai Wan War Cemetery.
Copied from https://www.winnipegsd.ca/schools/Kelvin/AthleticsAndExtra-Curricular/paperclip/Documents/Nov-Dec-15.pdf
End of Report.
Report generated: 02 Jul 2024.
Additional Notes
(These will not be visible on the printed copy)
- Service numbers for officers are locally generated for reporting only. During World War II officers were not allocated service numbers until 1945.
- 'C' Force soldiers who died overseas are memorialized in the Books of Remembrance and the Canadian Virtual War Memorial, both sponsored by Veterans Affairs Canada. Please use the search utility at VAC to assist you.
- Some birthdates and deathdates display as follows: 1918-00-00. In general, this indicates that we know the year but not the month or day.
- Our POW camp links along with our References link (near the bottom of the 'C' Force home page) are designed to give you a starting point for your research. There were many camps with many name changes. The best resource for all POW camps in Japan is the Roger Mansell Center for Research site.
- In most cases the rank displayed was the rank held before hostilities. Some veterans were promoted at some point prior to eventual post-war release from the army back in Canada. When notified of these changes we'll update the individual's record.
- Images displayed on the web page are small, but in many cases the actual image is larger. Hover over any image and you will see a popup if a larger version is available. You can also right-click on some images and select the option to view the image separately. Not all images have larger versions. Contact us to confirm whether a large copy of an image in which you are interested exists.
- In some cases the References displayed as part of this report generate questions because there is no indication of their meaning. They were inherited with the original database, and currently we do not know what the source is. We hope to solve this problem in future.
- We have done our best to avoid errors and omissions, but if you find any issues with this report, either in accuracy, completeness or layout, please contact us using the link at the top of this page.
- Photos are welcome! If a photo exists for a 'C' Force member that we have not included, or if you have a higher quality copy, please let us know by using the Contact Us link at the top of this page. We will then reply, providing instructions on submitting it.